Comments on: Grammar and Punctuation Rules – Learn ‘em; Forget ‘em

By: booga

booga — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 23:50:38 +0000

Admin: The plural of ellipsis is ellipses. There’s some irony in this article!

By: jorgekafkazar

jorgekafkazar — Sat, 18 Apr 2009 00:37:52 +0000

Devon: Certainly. I also revoke dash licenses, too, based on similar punctuation abuse. (Note: everyone has heard about poetic license, but I actually have a printed version.) jk jorgekafkazar’s last blog post..Stranded in Mexico

By: Devon Ellington

Devon Ellington — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 18:09:32 +0000

Jorge, may I borrow your "semicolon license revocation"? I need to use it on some of my students! Devon Ellington’s last blog post..Thursday, April 16, 2009

By: Jessica

Jessica — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 17:38:10 +0000

Thanks for stopping by my blog, Anne. That's a very interesting word you suggested. I like it. I'm both an developmental editor (content, organization, clarity, etc.) and a proofreader (both in the strict sense of proofing proofs against original copy and the more general sense of making sure spelling, grammar, and punctuation are correct). I agree with you that there is a difference between how those jobs are done, but the point of both is to make the manuscript clear. In my experience (and I know I'll get some flak for this), the reason why writers don't follow grammar and punctuation rules is usually because they don't know them or understand them, nor do they wish to. And again, that's fine with me. That's what I get paid to do. But as previous posters have said, you must know the rules before you can break them. If I'm to do my job well, there are precious few I would choose to break. Jessica’s last blog post..Word of the Week: Scobberlotcher

By: Analytical Understanding of Syntax?

Analytical Understanding of Syntax? — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 15:59:52 +0000

[...] Thanks for visiting! Write well and often, AI’ve started a small firestorm with my post, Grammar and Punctuation Rules – Learn ‘em; Forget ‘em. Benjamin Hunting who blogs at BenjaminHuniting.com, pointed, in his comment on my post, to an [...]

By: Bill

Bill — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 14:42:22 +0000

Bill – are you saying that when Latin etc. was actually used by the common folks there were rules? That’s the point.

I’m not sure what “common folks” means, either in ancient Rome or today.

If you’ve ever studied Latin, or any inflected language, you’d know that a minor misspelling would often change the meaning of the sentence completely. In fact, the accents–whether a syllable is long or short–can do the same. Not such a problem with spoken language (is this where the common folk come in?) but as far as I know it’s essential in written Latin. And classical Greek was originally written entirely in upper case letters, with neither punctuation nor spaces between the words.

Now, my point is that if you’re texting someone, and you write “r u in trubl at skool,” it’s clear. That is, both parties are communicating satisfactorily. But would you allow this in a published work, even a blog posting?

By: Bill

Bill — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 14:31:33 +0000

Another nifty bit of punctuation, though, is the leading question mark, as in:
¿What is going on here, he wondered.

Yes, it’s nifty, but it’s not English punctuation, and I can’t imagine any competent editor or proofreader letting that get by.

By: admin

admin — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 14:30:56 +0000

Isaac – agree on the exclam… of course, computer guru john devorak made a fetish out of using them everywhere in print… drove me mad, but I liked his stuff back then.

Devon and Lou, choice, yes, you’re right. You do need to know the basics then choose… good point.

Ben, fascinating link… I wonder what “analytical understanding of syntax” means? Sigh… I may blog on that article!

Bill – are you saying that when Latin etc. was actually used by the common folks there were rules? That’s the point.

Nothing wrong with dashes – em or other wise, ellipsis, or hyphens… but you can get along without them I don’t think you can get along in writing without periods, commas and quotes. That was my point there.

And of course it’s not a sentence, but it does communicate clearly I think.

Jorge, I’ve always liked the leading question mark… so logical to let the reader know what’s happing up front. Sadly I doubt we’ll see it in English in our lifetime…

Jessica, I suspect that what you do as an editor is more along the lines of making things clear than enforcing grammar rules… not always the same thing imo… but perhaps I’m wrong.

By: Jessica

Jessica — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 04:17:50 +0000

As an editor, this post makes my heart ache. However, a writer’s flagrant disregard for the rules is what keeps me employed. Carry on!

Jessica’s last blog post..Word of the Week: Scobberlotcher

By: jorgekafkazar

jorgekafkazar — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 02:05:38 +0000

Basically true, Anne. I've often told people in workshops that their semicolon license has been revoked. The same goes for dashes--too often misused. Usually commas, periods, quotes, and question marks would suffice and are sometimes even used correctly. I feel that the colon [:] is under-used, but it's seldom needed, so why confuse people? Another nifty bit of punctuation, though, is the leading question mark, as in: ¿What is going on here, he wondered. What is going on here, he wondered? is just plain wrong. He wondered, what is going on here? seems too much in the narrator's POV. What is going on here? he wondered. also seems off, because it ends twice, once with a question mark and again with a period. Best regards, Jörge jorgekafkazar’s last blog post..Stranded in Mexico